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Found the source of the leak!!!

on Fri Sep 21, 2018 11:36 pm
..... not the Head Gasket.


When it had the new timing chain, the "specialist" fekked the head!!!!!

Seriously pi$$ed off.


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Re: Found the source of the leak!!!

on Fri Sep 21, 2018 11:40 pm
Oh - where does this leave you ??
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Re: Found the source of the leak!!!

on Fri Sep 21, 2018 11:47 pm
LKsOK wrote:Oh - where does this leave you ??

Seriously pissed off.

Options are to get new / second hand head, second hand engine, or scrap it. Another option would be to bodge "properly" with some silicone filler, like they had done when the timing chain was changed - but not a very good idea!

I've posted a photo and asked for advice on the FB page. Not mentioned the "provenance" of the advert / car!
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Re: Found the source of the leak!!!

on Sat Sep 22, 2018 2:30 am
I'd get a feller with a TIG welder to fill that in then get it skimmed. That will remove the weld and all will be well. Specialist work, but can be done.

However, will be cheaper with a used head to be honest.

What's it off?
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Re: Found the source of the leak!!!

on Sat Sep 22, 2018 2:56 am
OK, one of those roadstirrup thingys....

A second hand head may be hard to come by then! You know any specialist TIG guys and a decent head shop?

Either that or this https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/332769500318

Looks decent and clean, so long as it's the actual head and not some generic photo (but you should be able to spot the difference).

Want me down there to do the job right Huge>

Fat bloke in a 4.0 V8 Range Rover, fuel, food and bed!!

Might just be cheaper with a whole new car Razz Very Happy
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Re: Found the source of the leak!!!

on Sat Sep 22, 2018 6:43 am
Doo 1 wrote:OK, one of those roadstirrup thingys....

A second hand head may be hard to come by then! You know any specialist TIG guys and a decent head shop?

Either that or this https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/332769500318

Looks decent and clean, so long as it's the actual head and not some generic photo (but you should be able to spot the difference).

Want me down there to do the job right Huge>

Fat bloke in a 4.0 V8 Range Rover, fuel, food and bed!!

Might just be cheaper with a whole new car Razz Very Happy


I posted the phots on the F/B group, not mentioning the chap who sold it to me or the specialist that did the job. I've had the offer of a free engine for parts - not sure of age, mileage or condition.

A couple have suggested filing down the damage and (obviously) adding a new gasket, with some filler / sealant product to seal the small hole left by the groove. Certainly dividing opinion on there! There is no pressure in that part of the engine; it's the timing chain that flicks oil up into the top corner of the chain housing.The access, now that the head is off, is much better than when they attempted to do the job in the first place. But, there is now way to test for potential leaks until it's all put back together!

I realise that the different opinions on FB (or any forum for that matter) will vary - mostly from people who don't have a clue (myself included!). But I also feel that it's been done before. There are some Smart specialists who access the timing chain via the rocker cover / timing chain cover (as with mine). Then there are those who take the head off - the proper way to do it.

As you can see there was a quality job when the rocker cover was put back on!!!

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Re: Found the source of the leak!!!

on Sat Sep 22, 2018 11:25 am
Feckin cars!

If the heads good on the spare engine that sounds like a good option to get you back on the road again

Have you spoken to DVLA about grounds for requiring details of the last registered owner?
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Re: Found the source of the leak!!!

on Sun Sep 23, 2018 10:53 pm
Paul123 wrote:Feckin cars!

If the heads good on the spare engine that sounds like a good option to get you back on the road again

Have you spoken to DVLA about grounds for requiring details of the last registered owner?

Not pursued the DVLA details to be honest. The post on the Roadster FB group has given a range of possible solutions to the problem, from fixing the damage to the offer of a free engine to take the bits from!

The good thing is that where the damage is there is no pressure in the engine and it's the chain that throws oil into that area. An engineer chap has suggested some liquid metal and sanding the surface flat. With the new gasket the fix should be good. But then there are some more old school types who suggest the replacement of the Head. It's down to the extra cost of rebuilding the head - shall find out tomorrow.

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Re: Found the source of the leak!!!

on Sun Sep 30, 2018 8:55 am
The head is in being fixed (welded) and re-skimmed. I've just posted a review on the Roadster forum of the "specialist". Will be interesting to see if it gets deleted by the main moderator - the guy who sold me the car!! May also post it on the FB page....

Review – M&M Motors (smart specialist)

I purchased my Roadster back in August, advertised as, “80,000 miles and just been subject to a full “C” service, new timing chain & mechanical overhaul by M&M Motors (smart specialist).

Now, I know that buying a second-hand car is very much a case of BUYER BEWARE, but given the provenance of the seller and the write-up above, I felt it was a good choice. The car felt really good when taken for a test drive, and I bought it.

A week or so later the turbo died, resulting in a cloud of white smoke. I fully accept that a turbo could have died on mile 1 or mile 200000, and it’s just one of those things. The seller, and M&M, supplied a replacement turbo and some cash towards the repair which I fully appreciate.

When the car went in for the turbo to be switched, we were able to look at the source of the oil leak. It turned out to be from the head gasket at the timing chain cover end. The gasket and head were very badly damaged, probably when the chain was replaced. Even if the damage had been caused on a prior chain change, the damaged head and gasket would have been very clearly visible. The rocker cover had been re-fitted very badly with a large amount of red silicone. The head has now been removed to sort the job properly, the gouge to be filled and the head re-skimmed.

As for the C Service, the air filter and spark plugs look new. But the fuel filter is not. Not sure if a C service would normally replace this or not.

So, all in all a very poor job on the timing chain replacement. I really cannot see that the damaged gasket and head could be missed. Not very happy.
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Re: Found the source of the leak!!!

on Sun Sep 30, 2018 12:21 pm
I think that's fair enough. Not too stroppy but informative.
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Re: Found the source of the leak!!!

on Sun Sep 30, 2018 12:38 pm
MegaCrixel wrote:I think that's fair enough. Not too stroppy but informative.

Not been taken down. Googling M&M they only have one review - from the guy I bought it from. His son in law...

Shall post the same thing on the FB page later.
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Re: Found the source of the leak!!!

on Sun Sep 30, 2018 6:21 pm
Did you mean 'not' or 'now'?
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Re: Found the source of the leak!!!

on Sun Sep 30, 2018 9:32 pm
Not - it's still there.

Had a reply saying that the fuel filter should have been done.

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Re: Found the source of the leak!!!

on Sun Sep 30, 2018 9:39 pm
Glad someone listened to my advice for once. Getting a weld & skim is probably the best way forward because buying another engine could be just as bad....

Anyway, sometimes experts aren't actually experts except in their own head.

I would never profess to be an expert even though I have had tonnes of experience, I'm just not that good!

An expert is someone who has done the same thing over & over & over & over & over...

I have done one or two things once or twice, but I don know some things and how to fix them.

What was the date again?? Mad Laughing Razz
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Re: Found the source of the leak!!!

on Mon Oct 01, 2018 9:36 pm
Things interesting on the Roadster Forum - I've just revealed the seller!!!

His dilemma is whether to ban me and hide it, or sit it out.....


http://www.theroadster.net/trc/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?post_id=290607


I don't knock the guy as he is clearly passionate about the cars. But he (or M&M) almost certainly knew about the issue.
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Re: Found the source of the leak!!!

on Mon Oct 01, 2018 9:47 pm
Ouch !!!!!

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Re: Found the source of the leak!!!

on Mon Oct 01, 2018 10:01 pm
LKsOK wrote:Ouch !!!!!


I hope my posting seems reasonable?
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Re: Found the source of the leak!!!

on Tue Oct 02, 2018 6:40 am
I see you have a reply, unsurprisingly it’s backing the work carried out by the garage. In turn suggesting the garage who are doing the work May have damaged the head - don’t really see that personally
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Re: Found the source of the leak!!!

on Tue Oct 02, 2018 6:51 am
Paul123 wrote:I see you have a reply, unsurprisingly it’s backing the work carried out by the garage. In turn suggesting the garage who are doing the work May have damaged the head - don’t really see that personally

Indeed. Had the job been done correctly by his garage, why would it leak?!!

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Re: Found the source of the leak!!!

on Tue Oct 02, 2018 7:03 am
It comes back to the advert

“Xyz done by garage” could have read “recent change of xyz” as there was no receipt, warranty etc

Hopefully Hugh you’ll have a very good roadster soon
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Re: Found the source of the leak!!!

on Fri Oct 05, 2018 3:37 pm
hmm, just read his reply with interest, obviously he deflects the issues with reasons as to why it couldn't have possibly been his or his mechanic (partners step dad) - i'd say if his partners step dad is a 'specialist' theres absolutely no way he would have not spotted the leak.....i'm guessing its more of a 'pfft, your gonna punt it on, just do they chain and get it sold'

plus, he reckons it would be a 5k car if it was perfect......dont talk shite!
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Re: Found the source of the leak!!!

on Fri Oct 05, 2018 10:09 pm
Spot wrote:hmm, just read his reply with interest, obviously he deflects the issues with reasons as to why it couldn't have possibly been his or his mechanic (partners step dad) - i'd say if his partners step dad is a 'specialist' theres absolutely no way he would have not spotted the leak.....i'm guessing its more of a 'pfft, your gonna punt it on, just do they chain and get it sold'

plus, he reckons it would be a 5k car if it was perfect......dont talk shite!


Indeed.

He also hasn't realised that the only reason we took the head off was because of the bloody leak!! Missing that, the fuel filter AND the breather pipe is shocking!

If I was looking to sell the car, I'd have run it for a bit to make sure all was well. I still haven't posted about it on FB yet! Shall wait a couple more days and make a long thread - "Buying a car "with provenance" - a warning!!"

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Re: Found the source of the leak!!!

on Sat Oct 06, 2018 9:08 am
i imagine he's feeling pretty embaressed as its his forum.....but yeah, rub some more salt in his wounds
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Re: Found the source of the leak!!!

on Sat Oct 06, 2018 11:12 am
Looks much better than it did. But they have only put 5 spark plugs back!?? 6 plugs in a 3 cylinder engine may have confused them....




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Re: Found the source of the leak!!!

on Sat Oct 06, 2018 11:40 am
What does this mean ????
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Re: Found the source of the leak!!!

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